Articles Tagged: prop 215

My medical marijuana recommend

October 7th, 2012 | By Pirate

I have serious enough medical conditions that I could probably get a medical marijuana recommend in some of the more restrictive states that have medical marijuana laws.  But I have continued to vow to let my recommend expire.

Well we moved to a new location, and right away I need to get some meds.  Well I found a few sources, but it was a pain in the ass to track them down.  So I got my recommend renewed again.

Despite that I have vowed to let it expire.  Despite that I have continually said that I don’t think MMJ laws are helping to end prohibition.

Well, I have now realized with the value of MMJ laws are for me (Thank you very much to the stand up folks who worked on this in the 70s, 80s, 90s and beyond.

Medical Marijuana Laws are similar to a club card that you would get at Costco or BMG music.  You pay a small up front free, and a small yearly fee and you get acess to great selection and sometimes good prices.

I feel like I am still exposed to the paradox in our federal/state relationship.  But not for just possession.  State law allows us to have up to an ounce with only a $100 fine as a penalty if got with less than an ounce (no arrest, no jail, no permanent record).  In some ways the medical marijuana laws (like Prop 215 CA for an example)  help on the side of safe access, and the decrim laws have helped on the criminality problems that came with possession.

So I think at this point California has made the most progress in cannabis law reform at a state level. I also do believe that medical marijuana laws are a helpful part of that.   But I think progress was bound to be made in this state one way or another.

It is necessary to address it on a state level first and foremost because states have their own laws against marijuana.  So if we only addressed it on a federal level, cannabis would still be illegal in many states on a state level.

So please take what I say with a grain of salt.  I do sometimes let emotion get the best of me.  I want the federal government out of our business, but I also would like the states to relax their laws quite a bit.  All states and stateman/stateswoman need to be educated on the values of the cannabis crops (all of the many varieties).

Cannabis does cure cancer, that is known world round. 

Keep up the fight!


This was April 2012 when I spoke about medical marijuana last, and I am always grateful for medical marijuana.
I just think that the government has found ways to even make medical marijuana  work against us.
This is that video:

To those who voted No on Prop 19

January 26th, 2011 | By Pirate

If Prop 19 was before me right now, I would vote for it.

I don’t like the taxation part of it, in that it would allow for excessive taxation.  I believe you’re right about leaving that door wide open.

However, municipalities are already passing marijuana laws at a community level.  Look at LA and San Diego, or Oakland for that matter.

Prop 19 in my opinion was not making it easier for municipalities to do this.  They do it anyway, with or without Prop 19.

The best thing about Prop 19, is it was not the final chapter in the story.  2012 comes around, we revise the law via another Proposition.

The second best thing that it did, was it created incentive for municipalities to compete for ganja business.
In a true free market, that would play out to the advantage of all cannabis consumers.

Not all municipalities would be dumb enough to force pot business out of their communities.   And the ones who tried to do that (Like LA and San Diego are doing right now), will be begging for them to come back.  Especially knowing that other communities would be getting revenue from these business.

Free market definitely works.  The competition would force municipalities to lower their licensing, or taxing codes in pricing, so that they had a healthy cannabis business.  
Same thing with vineyards and stuff, the history there is very similar.

I also believe very strongly that all of the hysteria about how it would effect medical rights, was out of whack.  I didn’t see anything in that initiative that said ANYTHING about amending or replacing Prop 215.

What I saw in Prop 19 was a not-so-perfect initiative that had a fighting chance of doing the following things:

1.  Making hemp crops available to our farmers (my family are farmers)
2.  Make social ganja legal for everyone over 21.   No fine, no police chats, nothing.
3.  Increasing California’s tourism substantially, in turn making tons of jobs
4.  Eliminating or significantly reducing the shenanigans of the cartels.   And giving their profits back to legitimate, legal, born in this country, business owners who are needing to put food back on their families tables.

What a vote against Prop19 did, was get cannabis one step closer to becoming rescheduled instead of legalized.

What I mean, is instead of getting it legalized in California for cultivation, possession and sales.   California reinforced this bunk medical theory, that all marijuana is medical.

Why is that bad?

Because people want to have tax free transactions just like other pharmaceutical drugs.

You wonder, what is bad about no taxes?

Non-profit laws exists for a reason, if you dont want to pay taxes like the rest of businesses, then go non-profit.  Sure there is a downside to being non-profit.  But on the other hand, you get what you want in regards to taxes.

However, the only things that get a tax break at the commodity level, are pharmaceutical drugs that are scheduled by the DEA as medicinal.

And what is so bad about that?

Well, do you know how difficult it is to become a pharmacist?  
What about owning a pharmacy?
Not to mention all of the paperwork, and records keeping, and blah blah blah.   Licensing isn’t’ cheap  for pharmacy owners either.

So if you want to turn this into medical only, and keep it that way.  Some day this will come back to bite you in the ass when the feds decide to turn marijuana in to a medicine.

Did you know that the federal government owns US patents on cannabis medicine.   (US Patent 6630507)

You just wait for the feds to take over this medicine before you want to start working towards legalization.   You will get this crop taken away from 80% of the people already in this industry.

I know you couldn’t imagine having to get a pharmacists license just to sell marijuana.   But it COULD happen.

Taxing medicine is immoral.

November 4th, 2010 | By Pirate

This is a point that I hear from the opposing side of Prop19.

A no on 19er said this to me in a conversation about why he opposes Prop19 today.

“”Taxing medicine is immoral. Why are you trying to take the ‘medical’ out of ‘marijuana’? Why do you want to punish the sick and dying?”

There was a lot more to it, and I have a PDF of the whole conversation.  But that is a point not only voiced by him, but Dragonfly and others have voiced that opinion as well.

My response is:

But Prop19 wasn’t responsible for taxing marijuana. What I am saying is Prop 215 is not going to do th…ese to things for you EITHER:

1. Prop215 does not save you from capitalism, or large scale grow ops.

2. Prop215 does not exclude you from paying any taxes.

Everyone is complaining because Prop19 talked about taxes, and regulation.

Well millions and millions of dollars have been paid on marijuana in California. Thats a fact. And there are tax laws that do govern marijuana in California.   Check this:
To this day there is not a single law that excludes marijuana from being taxed in California, with exception to the non-profit laws.
Prop 19 did not change the non-profit (501c) laws in any way shape for form.
So these non-profit collectives that have not been paying taxes on marijuana, that would continue to be the case. Non-profits would still maintain their rights as non-profits.

What I am saying is not that I want to cause ANY malice to patients.
What I am saying is that Prop 19 did not effect Prop215. And Prop19 gave rights, it did not take any away.

The hysteria that you are stirring up is what concerns me.

If you think Prop 215 alone is better than both Prop 215 + Prop 19.. Then I can not understand your point of view.
Its almost like the difference between freedom and fascism to me.

Why reduce rights instead of giving more rights to more people?

If Prop 19 would have passed, millions of marijuana consumers would have had rights to grow, possess, transport and sell marijuana.
Yes I know, it covers sales and leaves it up to the municipalities.

Hmm. Its ALREADY up to the municipalities. Oakland is proof of that.

And patients do not stop getting the right to be patients.  Its not like Prop19 passes and the government finally deems all of these people well and good.

Tyranny prevails even longer in California

November 3rd, 2010 | By Pirate

Now that all that California has is Prop 215, which doesn’t protect recreational users, it doesn’t give a platform for hemp, and doesn’t further the cause.  California can also look forward to having an AG that will rape the MMJ market.  Looks like the “no on Prop19” shot themselves in the foot.

Had prop19 passed, the feds would simply have too much to deal with…. Now that it got shot down, Californians are like fish in a fish tank. 

Shooting fish in a fish bowl


Point is, what do we do next to fix this?
Prop 19 was the USA’s best hope for ganja freedom.

Now it’s Jack Herer 2012!

Proposition 19 to the Stoners Against Legalization

November 2nd, 2010 | By Pirate

This is a long conversation about Prop 19.
I want to make sure we are all accountable here in one year, to the claims and efforts we made one way or another.

So many in this conversation are anti-Prop-19. The problem with their hysterical argument is that what they are saying is NOT true.
How will I prove it? Well besides the actual wording in the initiative itself, I will rely on time to be the ultimate judge.

I have said it before, and I continue to say it now. Prop 19 and Prop 215 are complete separate issues.
Prop 19 does not govern medical marijuana, it only governs recreational marijuana.

PDF of the conversation – Richard Brumfield anti Prop19

This is my comment from a different conversation on facebook today, which involved many of the same people:

“I wonder what these anti-Prop-19 people would think if others were actively campaigning to make medical marijuana illegal.

Im sure they would react very quickly to defeat the proposal, and from what I have saw from a lot of these folks is …they use lies and irrational behavior to prove their points.

What if some shit head wanted to revert back to slavery?
Cuz that’s what prohibition is!

I have the right to speak my mind. Richard you and Dragonfly and your lot all have the right to speak your minds.

But don’t complain when other people speak.

No one is trying to take YOUR rights away. Why are you people fighting so hard to take Prop 19 away? In my consideration, it is YOU people who are working hard against freedom.”

Facebook Group: Dispensaries, if you don’t support legalization I wont support you

Also for those people involved in making a living off medical marijuana, and think that Prop 19 effects Prop 215, that is incorrect.
It is like saying “because some businesses pay taxes, that means all businesses pay taxes”. When it’s clear those defined as 501c Not-for-profit do not pay taxes. Its the same principle. So after Prop 19 passes, those who have a Prop 215 doc recommend will be subject to laws under Prop 215, everyone ELSE is defined under Proposition 19.

Its pretty simple.

Also if you think that marijuana is currently un-taxable, you are wrong except with non-profits. Non-profit status makes a 501c registered business exempt from taxes. Its true, different laws effect different circumstance.
If you are Prop 215, then you can still possess 3lbs as well as have 99 plants.
Prop 19 does a lot of things, but one thing that it doesn’t is change non-profit status in California!

Please see this video about Proposition 19

Yes on 19, No to Cartels

October 24th, 2010 | By Pirate

A random facebook message that came to my inbox

Adam Walsh October 24 at 2:38pm Report

Hey I saw you support Prop 19.Just letting people know that it will actually make pot more illegal. Swartzeneger just made possession of an once or less, the equivalent of a traffic violation…and 215 let’s you grow way more than Prop 19 will. There will be more arrests and less freedom as we hand over control to big corporations….this is why the most prominent marijuana activists oppose it, including Jack Herrer and Dennis Perone the creator of Prop 215.

Ryan Thompson October 24 at 2:45pm

Sorry bud, wrong guy. I am an informed voter.

Adam Walsh October 24 at 2:59pm Report

The elephant in the room seems to be that everyone wants to jump in on this “New Economy” to save the sinking ship of California, but no one wants to admit how Dependent on Marijuana we already are. You hear TV reporters calling it the second largest economy in the state, with this unspoken assumption that it’s going untapped. The reality is that the California Economy is not only intertwined with this “New Market” (which has really been here for 30 years), it is in many cases propped up by it. Mendocino County has estimated that it’s growers (mostly Mom and Pop operations) account for up to 2/3 of its total GDP. That is Billions of Dollars directly infused into restaurants, hardware stores, schools, auto mechanics, fire departments, Walmarts….and all of this money gets taxed every time it goes into a cash register. Though it would be nice to tap into this “new” revenue stream, the reality is that we ALREADY ARE. If we drastically curb this market, by consolidating all of this capital into the hands of a few large corporations and outlawing local Mom and Pop collectives (which is exactly what Prop 19 will do), the true effect would be to add $1.4 Billion in “new” tax revenue – at the expense of pulling another $10 Billion Out of circulation. Moral and political considerations aside, it simply does not add up. Let’s not rush into a poorly written bill, simply because we are so anxious to “Legalize It”. Let’s look at reality and keep our economy alive…Vote NO on PROP 19.

Ryan Thompson October 24 at 3:07pm

I am going to tell you about the black market that you seem to think isn’t a problem.

100’s of thousands of pounds of marijuana is produced by Mexican cartels, in the state of California. They ruin our wilderness, and they take all of the profits that they made off our citizens, and give it to cartel leaders who are waging a massive war on our borders.

Its not even as though the Mexican cartels are shipping the drugs in any more. They are just growing it on BLM land all over the place, especially in my home state of Utah.

Taking the marijuana industry back is vital to the survival of our country.

YES ON 19,8599,1917547,00.html

Adam Walsh October 24 at 3:39pm Report

Nobody likes Mexican Cartels, but do you really think Prop 19 will stop them from doing anything? If they are crazy enough to put 4000 plants on federal property, they surely aren’t going to pay attention to these new restrictions. All this will do is criminalize the smaller Mom and Pops, who otherwise would be foreclosed on in our horrible economy.


Ryan Thompson October 24 at 3:45pm

Adam, the issue will be about WHO supplies it. Right now selling recreational marijuana is illegal. But that’s what they cartels like. The more the risk, they higher the profits, the more reason to shoot people up.

When we take the industry back from the cartels, they won’t have the advantage of prohibition on their side.

Currently El Chapo from the Sinaloa Cartel, is in Forbes magazine as one of the worlds billionaires.

I’m ready to do with marijuana, what we did with alcohol in the 30’s. Did it work in the 30’s? Yes, in my opinion. And it will work now.

Adam Walsh October 24 at 4:14pm Report

This is absolutely about WHO supplies it.It’s about Medicine For the People By the People.For 30 years this is the ONE thing we have had that Big Business could not touch, and now were ready to just hand it all over to the Tobacco Industry….who I’m sure will be no less kind to the earth than any other Mega Farmer.

Decentralized Economic and Agricultural Systems are vital to this planet’s survival. It’s the same debate surrounding GMO’s. They could easily Legalize it, without handing over this precious resource to a bunch of money hungry Fascists.

Ryan Thompson October 24 at 5:11pm

Ive not saw any evidence that the tobacco industry is in the slightest involved.

However, consider Oakland right now. They are already issuing large scale grow permits, without Proposition 19.  Prop 215 doesn’t protect you from capitalism.

Lets think about the Hemp Industry.  Prop 215 doesn’t give any platform for that.  Proposition 19 does.

Legalization opponent gets stung by prohibition

September 24th, 2010 | By Pirate

“Paul E. Ellis, 52, was described by detectives as eager and talkative when they approached him at his dispensary, Med Mar Dis, at 7604 E. Sprague Ave., last month. He showed them his marijuana, explained how he tracks his transactions with about 200 customers and invited them to his home to see his marijuana crop.”

Read More..

Med Mar Dis owner gets busted in Spokane

I have good sources who were working on I-1068 who mentioned that they spoke to this guy, and upon hearing more about what I-1068 was about refused to support it, because he claimed to “be against legalization”.

This story also fits in my Facebook group  “Dispensaries if you don’t support legalization, I won’t support you“.

Don’t get me wrong, this type of story is sad news, and no one should be getting raided for this harmless plant.  But how ironic, this guy is against legalization but then gets stung from prohibition.

When will they learn?!   Please look at the bigger picture.  More freedom for more people, is worth way more than this tiny little medical marijuana community.

Freedom is the bottom line for me.  I-1068 was absolutely beautiful too.  I-1068 was the most well designed laws I’ve read.

18 and under still had the same penalties as before I-1068, and adults over 18 can consume, distribute and cultivate cannabis.   Taxes apply on a retail level, just like buying sugar at the store.

Other than that, no restrictions for adults.   But some dispensary owners don’t support legalization.  One can only wonder why?

Similarly, Dennis Peron who wrote Califronia’s Prop 215 for medical marijuana and disputably owned the first cannabis club in LA, and certainly the most successful one.   But due to legal issues no longer runs a dispensary.  He is still a cannabis consumer but he says that ALL cannabis usage is medical.  There is no recreational.  It’s all medical.

More at this article: (Russ Belville on statements made by Dennis Peron regarding Proposition 19)

Vote YES on Prop 19! Legalize Marijuana 2010

August 30th, 2010 | By Pirate

I am not currently a California resident, but I own property in California, and I grew up there off and on.
We will be moving back to Cali within the next 12 months, and this is partially why.  Prop 19 baby!

Proposition 19 offers more freedom to more people for using cannabis.

In my video I describe how I don’t believe Prop 19 effects medical marijuana, and how local municipalities are already taxing and regulating medical marijuana.

I think it’s a shame that only less than 100,000 Californians get to enjoy legal marijuana, but millions of others are at risk of getting a cannabis crime (drug crime) on their record, which would make life much more difficult for most.  (jobs, school, military service can all be interfered with by having a drug crime on your record).

It is time we START to restore freedom with Prop 19, and it is important to amend this law to make it less restrictive in the future.

Please see my video blog.

Devils advocate; Prop19 does not exempt cannabis medicine from taxes

August 22nd, 2010 | By Pirate

This is the statement I often get from opponents of Prop 19.

“Proposition 19 does not exempt patients from taxes”

My answer:

If Proposition 215 doesn’t already do that, then Proposition 19 won’t change anything.

Medical marijuana is already technically taxable in California.

At present only a portion of the state’s 200-plus medical cannabis dispensaries pay sales taxes. In principle, medical cannabis is subject to sales tax under current Board of Equalization rules, which exempt only drugs dispensed in licensed pharmacies by a physician’s prescription. However, many patients’ groups contend that sales tax shouldn’t apply to non-profit cooperatives and collectives.

So that is a reason for another new initiative.  If people want marijuana to not be a taxable substance for patients, then they need to step up to the plate and make that happen.  Because medical marijuana, unless prescribed via a pharmacy with DEA drug scheduling, etc, is not presently exempt from taxes.  So again, Prop19 doesn’t change Prop215.

Why I support Prop19

August 22nd, 2010 | By Pirate

I have vested interests California politics. Since I will be living there by year’s end again, and since I am a cannabis consumer. You don’t have to worry about my opinion, as you likely have your own on this topic.   So take it or leave it.
But it’s VERY obvious to me, that more legalization is better than the current system. Prop19 is not perfect. But it does not override Prop215, and it makes cannabis legal (even if in part) for millions of people.


Currently how many folks can legally cultivate marijuana?
Answer = Less than 100,000 people

Currently how many folks can legally possess marijuana?
Answer = Less than 100,000 people

Currently how many people are at risk of being charged with a cannabis crime for simple possession?


So if Prop 215 is not effected by Prop19, and if more people can enjoy more freedom. Then WTF is the problem?

I don’t have a problem with Prop19, other than I will push later for another initiative to increase the freedom allowed under Prop19.

I intend to see the age limit decrease to 18 years old.
I intend to see the grow area restriction be eliminated.

But that’s the greatest thing about ballot initiatives!